It started with tacos. In “Coushatta,” the eighth episode of the fourth season of Better Call Saul, viewers were introduced to a character who had been referenced (but not seen) all the way back in season two of Breaking Bad: the legendary Lalo Salamanca, nephew of cartel leader Hector Salamanca. Drug cartel soldier Nacho Varga thought that his problems with the Salamancas had been solved when Hector had a stroke, but was shocked to find Lalo cooking tacos in El Michoacano, the headquarters for the cartel’s Albuquerque operation.
Played by Tony Dalton with a terrifying charm, Lalo strode into the world of Better Call Saul and gave it an entirely new energy. Dalton was already a star in Mexico, but Saul brought him to a new audience, as did his subsequent casting on the Disney+ show Hawkeye as Jack Duquesne. With the sixth and final season of Saul about to premiere on AMC on April 18th, Dalton checked in with GQ to discuss what makes Salamanca tick, what it’s like to play a sociopathic charmer, and the importance of using epazote instead of cilantro.
GQ: How is the Lalo of season six different from last season?
Tony Dalton: I think that Lalo in season five wasn’t taking everything very seriously. He was kind of on vacation, taking care of the farm if you will. He went back home when it was all over. He said, “That’s it.” And then they went in and they killed all his people [season five ended with a failed assassination attempt on Lalo, initiated by Nacho.]. Now he’s pissed. Now he’s not happy anymore. And he was happy the whole time. It’s not even his fault! He was having a good old time. They were the ones who got him all pissed.
What drives Lalo?
I remember one of the things that Vince and Peter told me about Lalo is to think of him as a prince. Think of him as this sort of Prince of the Narcos. I have some very clear images of what Lalo is to me. I have a really good friend who’s an actor. He’s got a lot of charm. And I kind of a little bit based Lalo on him, his kind of persona. He’s one of those guys where you just want to be around him all the time. And, also, a little bit on Jules Winfield, Sam Jackson’s character in Pulp Fiction. It was really those two guys. These guys that are just, if they leave the scene, you want to leave with them. If they’re on the scene, they light it up so much that you can’t take your eyes off of them. That kind of energy.
How important is charm to this character? He has an ability to make people feel comfortable, even though he’s a sociopath.
I think that’s one of the things that I was able to bring to the character that wasn’t on the paper. I’d done characters before that were exactly the opposite—no charms, grays, stoic. So I just wanted somebody that you wanted to see and be with the whole time. Also the fact that the whole series—the bad guys are very serious, from Gus to Tuco. They’re very not happy campers. Let’s make this guy say the same lines that are written but just with this ease and this sort of Jack Nicholson kind of … “Everything’s gonna be fine. Don’t worry about it. Yes, I’m going to kill you, but everything is going to be fine … with me.”
There’s a terrifying ease about the decisions Lalo makes. He doesn’t seem to worry about much.
Of all the characters on Better Call Saul, his character is the one who cares the least. Not everybody has to care about what’s going on all the time. Lalo can not care. That was what I was looking for.
And on the other end is Gus [Fring, played by Giancarlo Esposito], who is anxious about every decision in every scene. He’s got such a tight body language, and you’ve got a loose body language.
Correct. That’s another thing. When I was creating the character. I watched the whole series and was like, “OK, what’s missing here? What can I bring to the table that’s not here yet that would create a juxtaposition? A sort of new fresh air there.” That’s kind of how Lalo came about.
How important is the mustache to Lalo?
Apparently, a hell of a lot important [laughs]. I had a mustache [during the audition] because I was on some trip or something, and I did the callback for Lalo and I didn’t have the mustache. And they were like, “You got the part if you grow the mustache.” All right. I guess the mustache got the part, not me [laughs]. That’s why I’m keeping it, man.
How much were you told about the arc of the character when you were hired?
I knew nothing. I thought, this will be fun. Go on for a week or two. But then they called me back for season five. And then it was very serious. They were like, “We want you to be part of this whole thing.” That’s amazing.
At that point, how much did you know about the end game? How much did you know about where Lalo was going to go and when did you know it?
No idea. And I don’t even think they did. When we were on the set, I talked to Peter Gould, I think he was directing, and he said, “This is great because we were always wondering how Saul was going to end up in the world of danger and narcos. And you did it.” And I said, “What do you mean? You didn’t know?” And he said they didn’t know how they were going to do it. And that’s amazing to me that these guys really just kind of feel the episodes, feel how it’s going and work on that. I’ve worked on a lot of shows where they already know what’s going to happen to the end. It’s kind of like I got on the gravy train, man.
That’s surprising. There are stories of Breaking Bad being planned out from the beginning.
I kind of overheard this. I’m fascinated by this. I’ve written a couple of screenplays that have become movies. The whole writing part of it to me, especially these guys who are the best of the best, I was curious how these guys go about getting all of this done. Getting everything moved in a certain direction. And as far as Lalo was concerned, like I said, you didn’t know where he was going when you first saw them. And then he ended up being a key element to how everything unfolds. Even in that scene where he walks into Jimmy’s apartment and talks to him and Rhea and says, “tell me again.” [In episode 5.9, “Bad Choice Road,” Lalo interrogates Jimmy and Kim about an ambush in Mexico.] What happens in that scene unfolds everything that goes on in season six. One scene just exploded, and it was like now they’re in trouble, now he’s mad—it’s amazing how these guys do it.
How collaborative are they? I heard that you helped a bit with the translations into Spanish.
I did. I’m glad to do it. There were some things that if translated exactly as it was in English wouldn’t work in Spanish. It would be the correct translation, but it would be not the way that you would normally say it in Spanish. And that was just for the translations. They don’t really let you kind of get a lot involved [in the writing]. They know the character better than you do. They created this world. They’ve been together since Breaking Bad. This is sort of their thing.
Look, for example, I think it was the first scene I was in that Gordon [Smith] had written and he had put a scene where I had made some tacos to give to Nacho and it said something like, “Here, I put some cilantro in the tacos.” I went up and said, “Listen, cilantro is not a big deal.” And he was like, “No.” And it was my first day! And I was like, “Let’s make it a little more ethnic. Let’s use epazote.” And he looked it up on the internet and said it was all good. It’s that kind of little change. But it makes a difference.
What’s your favorite moment so far for Lalo?
I’d say that scene where I go in with Kimmy and Saul to their apartment and I tell them to tell me again. Just the way that we shot it. The way it was written and directed by Tom Schnauz. That whole scene was very tense. I hadn’t worked with Rhea and with Bob, and I didn’t know if I was going to ever again. So you sort of show up there with your A-game. It ended up being a really cool scene. It worked out perfectly.